Who's next?

[Lachlan1]

Hi Team,

I've noticed of late there have been a lot of posts in relation to finches we have lost in Australian aviaries. We all know birds like Saffrons, OC waxbills, Purple Grenadiers etc are very rare and are bred by a select few but are there any finches we currently keep and are considered "common" that could be headed down the same road? The main reason I've created this topic is to ask everyone from beginner to specialists what birds do they think could be in trouble if we don't make an effort on them now. Now with social media so accessible we really have no excuses anymore to lose any of the established species from our aviaries due to how easy it is to communicate information. So lets communicate and try and prevent any further losses.

For example I will start by saying I find the number of Auroras and Pictorellas around atm somewhat concerning but would love to be informed otherwise.

Cheers.

[Tiaris]

I know a few breeding Auroras lately which is good as they are not about in near the numbers they used to be. Melbas are an even bigger concern I reckon with very few aviculturists breeding them consistently. Yellow-winged Pytilias are possibly also in the same boat, although never having been near as common as Auroras & Melbas in their glory days. The Pytilia species generally have declined dramatically in the maggot era of late and definitely are deserving of special attention IMO.
Pictorellas are certainly in high demand recently after a their previous lull & I have no doubt they will be bred up in the next few years & people will be forgetting about them again as it seems to go with them over time. Market forces & avicultural fads are fickle but highly influential factors which take their toll on captive gene pools.

[arthur]

On Melbas . .

Took my Grandkids to the petshop the other day . . good excuse . . and there were 4 pr of Melbas in top nick

I was surprised to see Melbas in a petshop, and was equally surprised by the price @ $110 pr.

The same petshop is not noted for giving things away, so the breeder probably got about $55 pr.

From the concern expressed in other areas of the forum about the availability of Melbas, I thought that $110 sounded quite reasonable

What would be the expected price?

[Tiaris]

I reckon anything around $100pr is reasonable of late.

[Lachlan1]

The Pytilia species generally have declined dramatically in the maggot era of late and definitely are deserving of special attention IMO.

Interesting point. Do you think it has had an effect on other species as well or birds such as blue-caps will always be somewhat safe due to their colours and appearance?

[Craig52]

Even though i had alot to do with the maggot era i totally agree with Tiaris and you with blue caps.No matter how i tried to get those two species to breed well on maggots,the results were extremely poor with either young thrown from the nest at a few days old or getting one or two to survive.Thinking that those one or two would cut the hard wiring to termites was also a disaster.
The blue caps and pytillias will slowly disappear if we continue to try and raise them on bushfly maggots and i applaud anyone who continues feeding termites to these birds because if we don't we are going to lose them.
I can't think of any other foreign or native finches that have suffered so much due to feeding maggots than these two species. Craig

[Tiaris]

Bluecaps are only safe if at least a handful of breeders are regularly putting young birds on perches. No matter how in demand they may be because of their beauty, if they aren't being bred in numbers by more than one breeder (& more than one bloodline) they are definitely in danger in the future. As Craig said, they do rely very heavily on regular termite supply for anywhere near consistent breeding prospects. Far too many top quality birds in this and other species, with their full breeding potential ahead of them are bought & brought into collections where they don't stand a hope in hell of being bred well so their breeding potential is totally wasted. This is a tragic waste of good birds and a nail in the coffin for the future of the species in our aviaries. If people aren't prepared to change what they do (stocking densities, diet, aviary fitout, etc.) in order to meet the known requirements of challenging species, they shouldn't purchase them at all IMO. Yes, Bluecaps are definitely in the same category as Pytilias regarding their strict termite preference.
Other species bear watching for other reasons though eg. Oriental Greenfinches, Nuns, Yellow-rumps, even Red Strawbs could do with a lift as I'm sure could many others. Constant vigilance by most breeders as to which ones are slipping below the radar plus a regular band of devotees to each species/group of species is desperately needed to slow these declines I reckon.

[Lachlan1]

I had an interesting conversation today with another breeder when I went to visit today. He said he knows of a breeder that has had success with feeding Pytilias and Bluecaps maggots with Safflower oil on them (that is what he believes the guy said anyway). This is probably old news to a lot of you but I found the concept of changing the smell of a food to make it seem like another interesting. I will try and find out exactly what the breeder uses in the coming days and let you all know.

Other species bear watching for other reasons though eg. Oriental Greenfinches, Nuns, Yellow-rumps, even Red Strawbs could do with a lift as I'm sure could many others. Constant vigilance by most breeders as to which ones are slipping below the radar plus a regular band of devotees to each species/group of species is desperately needed to slow these declines I reckon.

I completely agree. Hopefully other avicultural clubs are doing the same thing as the QFS in regards to their conservation programs. I'm sure they are it just wouldn't be advertised as heavily. It's interesting how almost all the species mentioned in this topic don't have an established mutation (not that I know of). It's funny how mutations can save a bird (or give it a popularity boost) yet without some breeders vigilance to keep pure strains it can be their demise as well.

[Painted4]

I had an interesting conversation today with another breeder when I went to visit today. He said he knows of a breeder that has had success with feeding Pytilias and Bluecaps maggots with Safflower oil on them (that is what he believes the guy said anyway). This is probably old news to a lot of you but I found the concept of changing the smell of a food to make it seem like another interesting. I will try and find out exactly what the breeder uses in the coming days and let you all know.

Other species bear watching for other reasons though eg. Oriental Greenfinches, Nuns, Yellow-rumps, even Red Strawbs could do with a lift as I'm sure could many others. Constant vigilance by most breeders as to which ones are slipping below the radar plus a regular band of devotees to each species/group of species is desperately needed to slow these declines I reckon.

I completely agree. Hopefully other avicultural clubs are doing the same thing as the QFS in regards to their conservation programs. I'm sure they are it just wouldn't be advertised as heavily. It's interesting how almost all the species mentioned in this topic don't have an established mutation (not that I know of). It's funny how mutations can save a bird (or give it a popularity boost) yet without some breeders vigilance to keep pure strains it can be their demise as well.

First point is very interesting, and i'm curious if it would work....i'd love to get a pair of Bluecaps and Red face Pytilias later down the track, but have no access to termites, so they were off my 'wishlist'.

I know the Barossa Bird Club was doing something with Pictorellas, Red Broweds and Long-tails...Not sure if they still are working on them or not.

[Craig52]

[quote="Lachlan1"]I had an interesting conversation today with another breeder when I went to visit today. He said he knows of a breeder that has had success with feeding Pytilias and Bluecaps maggots with Safflower oil on them (that is what he believes the guy said anyway). This is probably old news to a lot of you but I found the concept of changing the smell of a food to make it seem like another interesting. I will try and find out exactly what the breeder uses in the coming days and let you all know.

It would be very good if that worked but i find it hard to believe as the maggots would sufficate and die then spoil,pytilias and blue caps need live food on tap so to speak and wont touch dead maggots.
In the early days i was told to put a few drops of aniseed oil on the maggots to make them smell typically like termites,they ate them like normal but it made no difference with them chucking the newly hatched young out.They are hard wired to termites and if you don't feed them let the breeders that do feed termites keep them from disappearing.
Another question from me is,do finches have a sence of smell?,i know some raptures can. Craig