Pale Form of Diggles Finch

Parsons and Diggles
Includes Species Profiles
User avatar
mickw
...............................
...............................
Posts: 365
Joined: 08 Jun 2009, 19:49
Location: Port Macquarie, NSW
Location: Port Macquarie

Fincho162 wrote:My "informants" info based on their geographical locations still suggest otherwise sir!!

Nah, I think its just a distributional overlap between Homo clumperii and Homo splitterensis :P :lol: :lol:
User avatar
Myzomela
...............................
...............................
Posts: 1545
Joined: 24 Jan 2011, 18:44
Location: Melbourne Vic

mickw wrote:
Fincho162 wrote:My "informants" info based on their geographical locations still suggest otherwise sir!!

Nah, I think its just a distributional overlap between Homo clumperii and Homo splitterensis :P :lol: :lol:
This seems to be a common issue these days. What we once considered to be different species or subspecies are now often considered just differently coloured populations of the same species.

At the end of the day, if different populations are distinct enough in appearance, it doesn't matter if taxonomically they are classified as species, subspecies, races or populations.

It only matters whether we are interested in saving these distinct forms or not and if we have the inclination and resources to do so.
Research; evaluate;observe;act
User avatar
Fincho162
...............................
...............................
Posts: 263
Joined: 11 Jan 2011, 13:38
Location: Hobart

The old clumpers & splitter joke aye.......that's the second time this week................would u believe third time???
That might make me Homo fencesitterus Mick!!!!

Given that many may be relict species these days u are possible correct but the decriptions of some of the smaller "races - for lack of a better word" suggest far more variation than say between Masks & White-eared masks.......................also many point to what we have today and say it must be so/wrong..............with the massive habitat destruction through Queensland who knows what we've already lost.........remember mouth brooding frogs??
And who'd have ever believed that a flock of Gouldians could take over an hour to pass through a camp site.......and that was only in the early 1950's...................

However, I once had a discussion with the father of well-known fincho David Myers from NSW about the races of Parsosn and he had even more than I "postulated"....................anyway...............anyone seen the Pale Diggles lately............sigh...............................
User avatar
finchbreeder
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Posts: 10316
Joined: 27 Jun 2009, 20:00
Location: Midwest of West. Aust. Coast
Location: Midwest of West.Aust.Coast

Just a thought. With the reduction in habitation the quantities will decrease. BUT those that remain will be isolated from each other. And therefore the "races" could become more obviously different over time due to no longer "cross breeding"
LML
LML
User avatar
Fincho162
...............................
...............................
Posts: 263
Joined: 11 Jan 2011, 13:38
Location: Hobart

.............if they don't disappear along with their habitat.............or become assimilated into the nominate species/race..................
User avatar
Danny
...............................
...............................
Posts: 794
Joined: 02 May 2011, 08:04
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD
Contact:

Forshaw's argument for dropping back to two forms was that genetically there is no separation within the "diggles' races and within the 'parsons' races and specimens fitting the morphological gamut of previous races can be found within a single flock.
User avatar
Fincho162
...............................
...............................
Posts: 263
Joined: 11 Jan 2011, 13:38
Location: Hobart

..............great maybe unless there is no overlap and the colonies/races have differentiated/evolved in isolation.............................lets agree to disagree.............they are out there!!!!!!
User avatar
Fireback
...............................
...............................
Posts: 50
Joined: 06 Jan 2012, 20:18
Location: Australia

The Diggles around Coen, further up the cape appear to be a smaller bird, than the birds along the Gilbert river. Cheers
User avatar
Danny
...............................
...............................
Posts: 794
Joined: 02 May 2011, 08:04
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD
Contact:

Fincho162 wrote:..............great maybe unless there is no overlap and the colonies/races have differentiated/evolved in isolation.............................lets agree to disagree.............they are out there!!!!!!
I never said I agree with Forshaw - just outlining the most current thinking and what he'll be putting in his book. I had pure wild caught nigrotecta's , ex zoo, for many years and they were certainly not the same bird as the regular diggles that lived next door.
User avatar
Tiaris
...............................
...............................
Posts: 3517
Joined: 23 Apr 2011, 08:48
Location: Coffs Harbour

Taxonomy is such a temperamental and subjective field. It appears to me that the findings of one taxonomist are limited/inhibited by the number and diversity of specimens of each species they have observed and the range of habitats (or lack thereof) they observe them in. Today's current thinking is tomorrow's historical whim despite each new generation of taxonomists claiming to have more discerning technology/method. For what its worth, I don't at all care what the current thinking is at any particular time. For the benefit of the aviculture/ornithology of each species, I much prefer Gregory Matthews' recognition of many different geographically distinct "forms" of many species. Our recognition that all these different forms exist can only add to our understanding of the species and their various adaptations. I know from my own keeping of different "races" within the same species, these different races don't only look a different shade, shape or size - they have differing dietary, nesting, habitat, courtship, vocalisations and other behaviours and preferences. If we fail to even recognise the existence of these differing forms we are not giving ourselves the chance to understand these different features of the species which may assist greatly in our ability to find out what really makes them click. I certainly found that the pale Diggles was a very different bird to feed, house and breed than is the nominate Black-throated. And although the southern "Chocolate" Parson was not recognised as a subspecies itself, I always found its modus operandi in the aviary just as different to the nominate as is the Diggles. I firmly believe the taxonomic clumpers do no favours to aviculture. It is the splitters which give us extra possibilities for different forms to keep & breed & this can only add to our understanding of each species far more than failing to recognise the full diversity within each species.
Post Reply

Return to “Black Throated”