White Brested - Perth

[alvin]

I have pure white breasted Gouldian's, I have purchased a white breasted cock to add a different bloodline to my birds but every time I look at the breast colour of this bird, I don't think I want to use it in my breeding stock for 2018. This white breast has a slight bit of purple commonly seen in the AY. Would you say based on this, it is caring the AY gene or not. In all my years of breeding white breasted green backs and euro yellows all the breasts have been pure white. I breed the blue and don`t want any AY in my birds (personal Preference) I do like the AY on its own.

[Tiaris]

Sometimes the lilac breasted gene lurks in many white breasted birds. I know this is much paler than the proper lilac colour of that mutation as I've had the same chest colour that you are talking about in white-breasted stock years ago, but I strongly suspect it arises as a result of the lilac-breasted gene within white-breasted stock. Exactly how it appears this way I don't know, as I always culled any birds showing it from my breeding stock so could never prove its precise origin or mode of inheritence.

[Craig52]

There is other threads on this, a proper lilac breast is seen in cocks only as the hen has a lilac breast already. Purple seen in a white breasted bird is not lilac. It is the result of what is called a dirty white breast,usually bred from parents that are split for white breast so the mutation is weak in these birds.
It is a problem and can spread in future young but not all young, sometimes out of 6 young 2 will have it but the other four will be clean white breasted but those four young can pass it on also.
Imo, cull it now so you wont have problems down the track. Cheers Craig

[alvin]

I have bred split white breast to white breast and bred pure white breasted birds from them, not knowing the history of this bird makes it more difficult, I just thought its common in the AY, so maybe AY gene is in it. I don't know if that is the case and I also don't want to test breed it either.

[Tiaris]

I realise that the pale purple (or extra pale lilac) hue in this bird is not lilac as in the lilac mutation expressing itself properly, but I still believe it is linked somehow to the influence of the lilac mutation as this mutation is strongly genetically linked to the white-breasted one. In the past when I bred white-breasted birds it sometimes appeared from WB to WB matings as I didn't use splits in my deliberate WB breeding. The two forms both appeared from the same breeding flock of WB birds. This and the proper lilac phenotype birds were always culled so I could never fully ascertain its exact link or mode of inheritence but I still believe it is a genetic trait in some WB stock & that it has some genetic link to the lilac mutation. I had a different group of pairs of WBs several years after the above lot which never produced any "dirty WB" or lilacs, hence my suspicion of a link between the 2 forms. I realise that lilac is dominant and hence there are no visual splits, but it only requires one lilac gene to express phenotypically in a white-breasted bird but requires 2 lilac genes (homozygous lilac) to express itself in purple-breasted stock. All single factor lilac (heterozygous) birds within purple breasted stock are masked by the darker purple breast colour so remain visually hidden from us until either double factor bird is produced or they are used as an outcross for WB birds and then allowed to express themselves visually as a single factor lilac bird when combined with WB.

[Craig52]

I have bred split white breast to white breast and bred pure white breasted birds from them, not knowing the history of this bird makes it more difficult, I just thought its common in the AY, so maybe AY gene is in it. I don't know if that is the case and I also don't want to test breed it either.

Alvin, there is definitely no Australian yellow in this bird but a pic is always better for comments. Cheers Craig

[alvin]

Masking - I just bred my first lilac cock this season, DF pastel blue, purple breast cock to a yellow back purple breasted hen. young 2 cocks - single factors RH/LB/YB single factor - OH/WB/YB. I thought I had 2 double factor cocks until now, so I`m stumped. I had 3 DF blue pastel cocks paired to green split hens and all they ever produced in years of breeding them were single factor cocks, paired one of those cocks to a yellow split and got the above result.

[alvin]

I didn't worry about taking a pic as its not a bad dirty white, but its there and looking at it on the perch next to my other white breasts makes it look a lot worse that what it really is. I think I am just going to looking for a pair of normal white breasts for new blood.

[alvin]

So what would be your thoughts on breast colour pairings, lilac to lilac, lilac to white, lilac to purple, does the lilac breast carry the white gene or is it a separate colour on its own.

[Tiaris]

lilac is a separate mutation to white but more easily expressed via white breasted birds.