Linnet-Greenfinch-European goldfinch diet

An area to ask about species that are not Native to Australia.
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batuhan
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Hi All;
LINNET :
Linnets are present in the Oxford district throughout the year, but many leave in
October to winter elsewhere (mainly southern France and northern Spain), and most of
those remaining move out with the first snow; smaller numbers return in April. The
seeds of 46 plant-species were recorded in the diet in Oxford-mostly those of common
farmland weeds, which were taken mainly from the plants in summer and from the ground
in winter. The bulk of the food, as determined by both methods of investigation,
consisted of the seeds of Cruciferae, Polygonaceae, Chenopodiaceae and Compositae,while those of the Betulaceae, important to most other finches, were not recorded in
Oxford. Seeds varying in weight from 0.05 mg. (willowherbs) to 50 mg. (elm) were
eaten. Over the year as a whole seeds of Sinupis amensis and other brassicas formed
over a third of the total food, and those of Polygonum persicaria, Chenopodium album and
Stellaria media were also particularly important. Seeds from fleshy fruits were not
taken, and nor were buds, but other " greenstuff " such as the leaves of Stellaria media,
was recorded in every month by gut-analysis. Invertebrates were taken from April to
September but formed less than 1% of the total food.
ANIMAL FOOD THROUGH THE YEAR
Animals were less important to the Linnet than to any other finch. Although I
recorded them in the diet from May to September, in each of these months they formed
less than 1% of the food of both adults and nestlings.
Source /for reference purposes :I. NEWTON : EVOLUTION AND ECOLOGY OF FINCHES 33
THE ADAPTIVE RADIATION AND FEEDING ECOLOGY OF SOME
BRITISH FINCHES
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batuhan
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Greenfinch
ANIMAL FOOD THROUGH THE YEAR
Over the year as a whole, invertebrates formed about 1% of the diet as determined
by both methods. They were recorded by gut-analysis in every month, but from
September to March consisted entirely of various beetle larvae obtained along with the
seeds from the seed-heads of thistles and burdocks. At this time, however, animal food
formed but a negligible fraction of the total diet. Invertebrates, especially caterpillars
and aphids, were taken mainly from May to August and most of them were fed to the
young. Aphids were picked from the leaves of the various food-plants and caterpillars
mainly from the leaves of oaks, elms and hawthorns. No species were identified
specifically. The only animals found in the gizzards of adults in the breeding season
were two aphids in a female shot on 16 July.
Table 3 shows the percentage by volume of animals in the food of nestling Green-
finches according to age and time of year. Early broods received relatively more animals
than late ones, but in all broods the proportion of animals in the diet declined with
increasing age. Thus young hatched in May and June received an average of 10%
animal-material to the fifth day, but this had fallen to 1% by the ninth. Those hatched
in July and August received an average of 3% for the first three days, only 1% by the
sixth day and none thereafter. There was also considerable variation between the diets
of broods in the nest at the same time. Some very late broods may have been reared
entirely on vegetable matter, for no invertebrates were recorded during 20 visits (15 on
the first three days) to a brood in late August. It is of particular interest that Eber did not record any invertebrates in the food of adult Greenfinches in Holstein,
Germany, at any time of year, despite the extent of her data; but she did not apparently
examine any nestlings.
THE ADAPTIVE RADIATION AND FEEDING ECOLOGY OF SOME
BRITISH FINCHES
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batuhan
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Greenfinch:
Despite the continuous presence of aphids in the study area throughout the whole breeding season, greenfinches do not use them for feeding purposes during the second half of their breeding season. Therefore, the presence of invertebrates in the diet of cardueline finches appears to be unnecessary for nestling growth(Valera et al., 2005). Thus, the very low percentage of aphids found in the crops of
greenfinch nestlings suggests that they are taken accidentally.
Source : THE NESTLING DIET OF GREENFINCH CARDUELIS CHLORIS
IN ORANGE GROVES OF EASTERN SPAIN
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batuhan
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European goldfinch :
In April and June, the most frequently recorded food was the seeds of Senecio vulgaris,
in May those of Taraxacurn offi.inale, and from July to November those of various thistles (especially Cirsium vutgare and C. arvense), which, at their peak seeding period, formed
86% of the food.
ANIMAL FOOD THROUGH THE YEAR
Over the year as a whole, invertebrates formed 3% of the diet as determined by
observation.
For reference purposes : THE ADAPTIVE RADIATION AND FEEDING ECOLOGY OF SOME
BRITISH FINCHES

The amount of animal prey declined as the season progressed. This pattern was similar to that described by Newton (1972). It is not clear whether aphids and Coleoptera larvae were ingested incidentally with seeds and grass. The decline in animal food seems not to have any effect on nestling growth, given that the parents can rear their nestling in the final third of the breeding season without apparent difficulties (Gil-Delgado et al., 1991). On the other hand, availability of animal food may decline as season progresses. This decline could be a consequence of the use of rotovating machines, insecticides and herbicides to eliminate the herbaceous plants in the orange groves.
Therefore, in orange groves of eastern Spain goldfinches fed their nestlings with seeds of a few plants. Two species, S. oleraceus and C.pycnocephalus presented a higher contribution
(82 %).

Data analysis
Due to the differences in dry weight obtained
from each nest, we standardised the weight data.
To achieve this, we adjusted the weights for each
sample using the smallest sample size (2.63 mg)
as a reference. For instance, the nest with the
smallest sample size presented three food types:
Sonchus oleraceus(2 mg), grass (0.56 mg) and aphids (0.07 mg); and the nest with higher sample size with the same food types presented 79.12 mg, 2.56 mg and 0.27 mg, respectively.
The standardised weight data in the higher sample size presented the next new weight: 2.54, 0.08, 0.01 mg, respectively. Thus, each nest presents the same contribution. After this reduction, the frequency of every type found in the 31 nests was determined. We then measured the contribution, in dry weight, of the different food types to the nestling’s diet. Both seed and animal items were identified in laboratory using a binocular magnifying glass.

For reference purposes : AN EVALUATION OF THE USE OF A SPOONED SPATULA
TO ASSESS THE DIET OF CARDUELINE NESTLINGS
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batuhan
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Linnets, Greenfinches, European goldfinches and some others are seed-eating birds.
If you feed them with animal foods you can kill adult and their nestlings.
Of course they need animal foods during breeding season but very very very little.

But in spite of this for example;
Robins,Tits are insectivorous/insect eating birds.
Of Course they must mainly be fed with animal foods.

But again linnets, greenfinches and goldfinches are granivorous /seed-eating birds so they must be fed with seeds during breeding season with sprouted/germinated seeds and very very little with animal foods.
batuhan
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E Orix
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Your posts create discussion but using book references can tend to be misleading.
You must be careful with strong statements such as " If you feed animal foods you will kill
adult and their nestlings" inexperienced people read these and take them seriously.
Personal opinion I totally disagree with that particular statement.
Captive birds evolve, either by management or conditions as well as copying other species
kept with them in an enclosed situation.
For example I have a colony of Green Finches in my big flight, I would guest they would be
at least 15th generation as they have been together since the very early 80's with an occasional
bird added as an out cross. They will eat live food as they come to the Meal Worm tray year round
not just breeding season. Maybe they eat limited live food in the wild, that I do not know but in an aviary
situation they will. Why, simply copying other species eating Meal Worms, this also applies to Munias
and other species not regarded as big live food eaters. The only species I can not ever seeing at the
live food trays are my Gouldians but even those will have a crack at catching flying Termites on a
hot summers evening. A point you must realise, virtually every specie we keep in Australia are now
domesticated so they act and survive differently than birds in the wild or wild caught birds in an aviary situation.
Before I close, how or what part of the live food will kill the birds.
STUART WHITING
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Joined: 03 Jun 2017, 18:30
Location: England

E Orix wrote: 07 Dec 2017, 08:28 Your posts create discussion but using book references can tend to be misleading.
You must be careful with strong statements such as " If you feed animal foods you will kill
adult and their nestlings" inexperienced people read these and take them seriously.
Personal opinion I totally disagree with that particular statement.
Captive birds evolve, either by management or conditions as well as copying other species
kept with them in an enclosed situation.
For example I have a colony of Green Finches in my big flight, I would guest they would be
at least 15th generation as they have been together since the very early 80's with an occasional
bird added as an out cross. They will eat live food as they come to the Meal Worm tray year round
not just breeding season. Maybe they eat limited live food in the wild, that I do not know but in an aviary
situation they will. Why, simply copying other species eating Meal Worms, this also applies to Munias
and other species not regarded as big live food eaters. The only species I can not ever seeing at the
live food trays are my Gouldians but even those will have a crack at catching flying Termites on a
hot summers evening. A point you must realise, virtually every specie we keep in Australia are now
domesticated so they act and survive differently than birds in the wild or wild caught birds in an aviary situation.
Before I close, how or what part of the live food will kill the birds.
:thumbup: :clap: :clap: :thumbup:
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starman
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My understanding of Dr Ian Newton’s extensive research into European finches is that it was conducted on birds in their native wild environments. Although his painstakingly collected data is invaluable for students of these birds outside of aviculture, it is of lesser value to Australian hobbyists keeping European finches in mixed collections with birds that they would not normally encounter in their native habitats.
As we know with the common Australian and African finches, their behaviour, habits and diets after generations in captivity, are sometimes a far departure from those of their wild cousins.

Whilst the information put forward here is well researched, factual and technically quite fascinating, it is perhaps not completely relevant to Australian aviculturists.

To anyone interested in European finches, Dr Ian Newton’s acclaimed “Finches” is a very interesting, well presented and engaging read, but in my opinion, is of fairly limited value to Australian breeders/hobbyists hoping to improve their European finch successes.
Sm.
Avid student of Estrildids in aviculture.
STUART WHITING
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Joined: 03 Jun 2017, 18:30
Location: England

starman wrote: 07 Dec 2017, 13:35 My understanding of Dr Ian Newton’s extensive research into European finches is that it was conducted on birds in their native wild environments. Although his painstakingly collected data is invaluable for students of these birds outside of aviculture, it is of lesser value to Australian hobbyists keeping European finches in mixed collections with birds that they would not normally encounter in their native habitats.
As we know with the common Australian and African finches, their behaviour, habits and diets after generations in captivity, are sometimes a far departure from those of their wild cousins.

Whilst the information put forward here is well researched, factual and technically quite fascinating, it is perhaps not completely relevant to Australian aviculturists.

To anyone interested in European finches, Dr Ian Newton’s acclaimed “Finches” is a very interesting, well presented and engaging read, but in my opinion, is of fairly limited value to Australian breeders/hobbyists hoping to improve their European finch successes.
Well said :thumbup: :clap: :clap: :thumbup:
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finchbreeder
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Location: Midwest of West.Aust.Coast

A bit like people really. We no longer shoot our food with bows and arrows and chuck it on a fire. Instead we go to the closest supermarket or fast food joint. Human or bird we evolve according to what is available, sometimes for the better, sometimes not.
LML
LML
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