Yellow Siskin x Goldfinch mule project

[elferoz777]

Finally out of the nest.

Damn phone won't let me rotate and save

[collector_and_buyer]

Great result for you and the young Sisken hen.As she was sitting there without a partner at any rate,i personally don't see this as a waste of time or resource of a Sisken hen,but a positive thing for you and her.You stated that you could not find another cock Sisken so you paired her with the Goldfinch,in doing so ,it was a great learning curve for her as she bred successfully and should do so in the future.Leaving her without any partner would have been the waste,as she wouldn't have gotten this valuable lesson.Hope you are successful in finding a good cock Sisken for her next season.

[Tiaris]

Or run the siskins as a trio. They work very well this way generally. I have a trio currently which both hens have fledged their 2nd clutch for the season just 2 days ago. Both times both clutches fledged within 1 day of each other. Just highlighting that a spare hen Siskin is not necessarily a wasted breeding resource.

[E Orix]

The comments from collector-and-buyer are exactly why I have been very anti re this post.
C/B is entitled to his opinion but it reads that he is condoning the practice if this is so all I can do
is wonder what would have happened over the last 20+ years if the general bird breeders thought it
was a good learning curve.
In my opinion there has not been a good reason to hybridize any finches even when Canaries are concerned.
It's a pity that the person didn't put the same effort into breeding pure birds, then that would be something to
write about and promote.

[elferoz777]

If general breeders had the time, knowledge and commitment to condition to separate species, one wild caught and one aviary bred and get thrm to breed then the level of general breeding knowledge would be quite high.

What i have done is art and science combined and is a niche interest. Even if many wanted to, its not as easy as shoving two birds in a cage.

My next goal is to breed the male goldfinch with an aviary bred hen i have to get young goldfinches.

Ill have to think about my next hybrid but may try canary x goldfinches.

[collector_and_buyer]

What has he or the Species lost by him doing this?.He had already stated that the hen was a spare and it would have just sat there doing nothing,as he didn't have a cock bird.I am sure that he was also aware that he could run trio's,but elected to run his Siskens as pairs,so again,this was a spare hen.Why can't others acknowledge that even though this was a terrible sin in their eyes,that only something good has come from this for both the breeder and the bird.Nothing was lost,only gain.

[collector_and_buyer]

I forgot to include the following in my previous post.How do you[E.Orix] come to the conclusion that i condone the hybridising of any finches?.I am mearly giving praise to a breeder that had a goal and was successful.To assume that i condone this,is totally out of perspective and i am not sure how you have come to this conclusion.

[elferoz777]

Just to put this in perspective I ran 5 pairs of yellows this year.

2 in cabinets in flights and 1 pair I made a trio as I had another spare hen.

All produced clear eggs round after round. I have not got one on the perch to show for it.

MY red siskins are breeding as one would expect this time of year, they are on fire.

There must a microwave near the yellow siskin flight as this kind of horrid luck is hard to explain.

[elferoz777]

http://www.nativebirds.co.uk/index.php? ... 6&Itemid=7

For those with an interest in how mule breeding goes overseas.

Its almost an expansion of the canary clubs and our own shows here have a hybrid category.

[Tiaris]

Many clubs in Australia ceased the hybrid category many years ago & others more recently - this category is quite uncommon in Australian bird shows today.
Mule breeding in Europe is quite a common offshoot from canary breeding, however Europe generally also has a relatively open and steady supply of a wide range of exotic species as importations still occur. This is in marked contrast to Australia where apart from a regular supply of wild-caught feral Goldfinches and Greenfinches, our exotic species are entirely composed of a closed population of what is kept and bred in captivity by current breeders.
My fear is that as more people in Australia of European origin carry out deliberate production of hybrids among the serinus and carduelis (cup-nesting) species, these species' gene pools will inevitably become more tainted as is very evident in Oriental and Himilayan Greenfinch stocks. I believe these will be added to over time if the deliberate breeding of serinus/carduelis hybrids is encouraged and continued here as seems to be the case. It is hard enough to preserve genetically viable pure stocks of exotic species without this unnecessary extra pressure by those who choose to take that path in breeding birds. My fears are genuine as I have already seen far too many exotic species become extinct here and hybrids have been a factor in the demise of at least some of these.
If mule breeders in Australia are so resolute that they must continue this practice and see it as their cultural tradition, then I urge them to at least confine their activities to goldfinches and greenfinches which for now have a more open source of pure genetic material in Australia. Please leave our other cup-nesting exotic species alone.