Gouldian Nodule Colours

[Misso]

How many of us rely on mouth nodule colours to help i.d young in the nest??

i have used this technique to identify blue gouldians in the nest, because they have the white middle nodules compared with yellow nodules in normals.

This is my first season with Australian Yellow Pairs and this one pair has produced some interesting young. ( cock bird is BH/PB/GB split Aus Yellow ) x ( hen is BH/AUS YELLOW )

as you can see in the pic, the top babie is an Australian Yellow ( mouth markings are white on all 4 corners and yellow in the middle )

the babie on the right has white middle nodules ( indicating blue ) but you will also notice the bottom left nodule is a pearl white as well, instead of the normal blue nodules.



so originally i thought the pair is split blue also,

the babies are feathering up now and here is a progress pic.



So it turns out i have 1 Aus Yellow and 5 Split Aus Yellows, ( ALL GREEN BACKS ) and the babie showing the white middle nodules is the greenback in the bottom left corner with the very large white feathering on its head.

Do you think it could be the Aus Yellow Mutation that is effecting the nodule colours? ( as it has an effect of showing white on the top of the head or chin, could the mutation have got into the nodule colourings???? hence the 1 random pearl white nodule?????????

anyone else breeding aus yellows or other gouldian mutations that have experienced something similar?

cheers misso

[mackstaa]

Hi Misso,
Look at the beaks as well! I havent seen such variations in the modules before, as I have worked with few aus yellow, ive also never seen or maybe noticed the yellow feathering on the heads of splits. 1 thing I have noticed tho is day old chicks which have white center nodules turn yellow after a few days, cant quite say for sure if that means they are split blue, a bit more study i think.
Thanks for the share
mac

[SamDavis]

I too know little about nodule colours in AYS, but these are really great clear photos so once we get some consensus from the experts would you mind emailing me some higher res versions so I can use them to demonstrate at our finch club? If possible maybe take a few definite blue nodules and normal for comparison please?

[Craig52]

I have never seen split AY young with that much pied looking patch on the back of the head at that age,and also with the pied running into the bill for a split AY.
I really think you may have bred pieds and an AY.
The few yellow feathers on the neck and the white under the bill usually appears after they moult out into adult plumage,please keep us updated with pics. Craig

[finchbreeder]

Maybe the person at the Orange Sale who labelled their Aussie Yellows as Pieds was on to something. And they are in fact a form of pied? Both are recessive genes, both involve a yellow (or white) gene. Hmm
LML

[Misso]

I too know little about nodule colours in AYS, but these are really great clear photos so once we get some consensus from the experts would you mind emailing me some higher res versions so I can use them to demonstrate at our finch club? If possible maybe take a few definite blue nodules and normal for comparison please?

Hi Mate, send me an email address and il try and get some pics to you.

misso

[Misso]

UPDATE, was ringing the nest of 6 this morning, so thought id take another pic, when handling the bird i noticed his wing feather is also white.




I think it will maybe turn out somthing like Fincher's gouldian. ( viewtopic.php?f=90&t=5441)

Il say its just a split aus yellow, with a bit more heavy markings.

misso

[Blue Cuban]

Good topic and some interesting birds their Misso.
I don't claim to know much about AY's but of late they have really received my full attention and their is a part of me that thinks there may just be another mutation trying to express its self.

In regards to Mackstaa's comment about the middle nodules changing colour from white to yellow in the early days of young I strongly agree but I do want to point out that these birds that have the central nodules turn yellow were never a true white in colour just like the odd looking chick in the above picture.
This season for me has been a very good season and I have had the chance to photograph a lot of youngsters and the subtle colour change in their nodules and they all have a slight off coloured nodule in common.
I have spoken to breeders from Belgium and Greece and they have been using this colour change with a very successful rate with picking split blues.

Misso I'm unsure if the blue gene is known in your bloodlines and if it is I would think the bird in question is good odds to be split to blue if not it maybe some how be effected by what ever has effected the corner nodule to be pearl white.... Aussie yellow or pied...it's anyone's guess.

Don't suppose you took another picture of this birds nodules when you were banding them?
Rich.

[finchbreeder]

I will reinterate my comment, that Aussie yellows are mis named. And should really have always been called Australian pieds.
LML