All Aviary bred- I bet!!

[desertbirds]

Are we getting a little precious folks

Totally agree with Arthur and its a case of innocent until proven guilty. Its a big leap to see cheap birds advertised and assume instantly that the birds are wild caught. I heard a rumour that wild Lorikeets are full of PBFD , why would any serious breeder or other wise take the risk on these birds . Surely if people turn up to purchase the birds and there are no breeding pairs or in fact aviaries , the alarm bells would be ringing. In this case we are talking about birds that are secure in aviculture and the wild.

I think we need to remember that without wild caught birds , there would be no aviculture.

[desertbirds]

I thought it would be fairly obvious that I'm against all illegal trapping.

These birds are more than secure in aviculture also, so there is absolutely no need to be impacting our wild populations.

My point here was made with a specific example of legal trapping in the back of my mind. Here in WA, not all that long ago, someone was permitted to take 20 red eared firetails only from the wild, for the purpose of hopefully securing them in aviculture. THIS kind of trapping, regulated, rare, and justified, is in my eyes sustainable and acceptable. But this example is none of these things.

So spanna im wondering if that project went pear shaped , would it still be considered OK ?

[arthur]

My point here was made with a specific example of legal trapping in the back of my mind. Here in WA, not all that long ago, someone was permitted to take 20 red eared firetails only from the wild, for the purpose of hopefully securing them in aviculture. THIS kind of trapping, regulated, rare, and justified, is in my eyes sustainable and acceptable. [/quote]

But is it not also "trapping because you (someone) wants them"

Obviously and unfortunately (depending on where you live), the degrees of enlightenment differ from state authority to state authority

And a hypothetical before I sign off on this topic . .

How would the ratio of 20 Red-Ears to total wild population compare with the ratio of the trapped . . oops, I mean bred . . Rainbows to total wild population

Illegality does not necessarily make something wrong; any more than legality makes something right



I think the !@#$ rain is easing

[Craig52]

Hear,Hear, Arthur and DB Craig

[Niki_K]

I thought it would be fairly obvious that I'm against all illegal trapping.

These birds are more than secure in aviculture also, so there is absolutely no need to be impacting our wild populations.

My point here was made with a specific example of legal trapping in the back of my mind. Here in WA, not all that long ago, someone was permitted to take 20 red eared firetails only from the wild, for the purpose of hopefully securing them in aviculture. THIS kind of trapping, regulated, rare, and justified, is in my eyes sustainable and acceptable. But this example is none of these things.

So spanna im wondering if that project went pear shaped , would it still be considered OK ?

Hi DB, just clarifying something for my understanding- do you mean 'it' as in the original trapping, or as in continued trapping (presumably to boost genetic flow etc)?

[desertbirds]

Original trapping. However i wouldnt be against a genetic top up to ensure our aviary species have genetic diversity.

[jusdeb]

ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH palease people .

Im not feeling the love here

Hi Deb
Thank you for the information. I have passed this in to our Wildlife Licensing unit for investigation.

Regards
Barbara
Information Centre
Office of Environment and Heritage
T: 1300 361 967 F: 9995 5911
[email protected]

Its all we can do ....

[matcho]

The first add has already vanished into the eather.
LML

I am reading this post with interest and chuckling all the way along. What a great forum where we all express our views, no one agrees but all take on board others opinions. I dips me lid! Anyhow it seems to me that if what the quote above is real could it be that some of "them" monitor this forum or , god forbid, are they members? I hope not. In regards to the illegal/legal trapping of birds each state has regulations in regards to the "trapping" of birds. I 'm not sure if any use the trapping for transfer into the pet or avicultural trade but mainly for "pest" issues. That's just my take on things, if I'm wrong, then so be it but , I don't want a million replies telling me I'm wrong. Put it this way, last week I was having a bit of a stroll down along the "Green Corridor" at Leichhardt. Three little red browed chicks which to me looked not good at all were on the grass all together. Prime mini foxie food. Watched for 5 minutes and decided I would walk back to the car and grab the carry cage, scoop them up and try and see if I could attempt to hand raise, considering they were fledged. Came back with the carry box and would you believe it, parents turned up, fed them and they followed them back into the thick brush along the train line. Now the question is this. If I had caught them and handed them over to Wires I would be considered as doing the "right" thing. Yes? Or on the other hand if I had caught them, reared them and NOT released them after weaning would I be classed as a "trapper"? No doubt I would have transgressed some regulation because red brows in NSW require a special licence which I don't have. Never needed it years ago when red brows (red heads as we called them) were a dime a dozen. After all of this rant I am going to sit on the fence with this one. I can see pros in regards to the trapping of birds for avicultural breeding purposes to strengthen the gene pool of certain species, but please let us not be so naive to think that some breeders do not accept wild eggs and chicks and pass them off as being bred from their own flock when they have to submit their returns just to strengthen breeding stock.

Anyhow, great to think that this all originated from some rainbows, which are more common than sparrows in Inner Sydney and the fact that members of this forum care!

Well done.

[Myzomela]

Gees, I'm glad I brought this up!!!

I think there are several issues here. There are moral issues involved. In this day and age is illegal harvesting of wildlife-, common or rare, ethical?
Just because it continues does not mean that it is right.
As has been mentioned, without the trickle of "wild blood" from time to time many native species would have been lost to aviculture.
But the illegal trapping of reasonably large numbers of birds just to make a few bucks is reprehensible in my opinion.
This has nothing to do with boosting your breeding stock. It has everything to do with treating birds as a commodity, and those days are over. As a society I believe we have moved on from this. If you speak to the average person on the street you will find that keeping birds in cages/aviaries is seen in a less favourable light than it was 20 years ago. It doesn't mean that we don't have the right to enjoy and promote our hobby.
But some of the practices that may have been commonplace in the past are no longer acceptable.

This also raises the question is it ethical to take any wild animal and confine it in captivity- no matter what the reason. We justify it in certain circumstances eg to secure captive populations or to lessen numbers of pest species eg legal trapping of cockatoos in Victoria. But we can't ignore the fact that people are questioning the stress this causes to individual birds. I'm no tree hugging hippy, but these are the very questions our hobby faces into the future, and if we don't address them ourselves then they may be addressed for us- and that WON"T be good!!

Totally agree with Arthur and its a case of innocent until proven guilty. Its a big leap to see cheap birds advertised and assume instantly that the birds are wild caught. I heard a rumour that wild Lorikeets are full of PBFD , why would any serious breeder or other wise take the risk on these birds . Surely if people turn up to purchase the birds and there are no breeding pairs or in fact aviaries , the alarm bells would be ringing. In this case we are talking about birds that are secure in aviculture and the wild.

DB, sorry but you are being very naive if you really believe this. There is no way anybody could afford to breed any lorikeet and sell them for this price without carrying a terrible loss. I also note that there are no mutation rainbows, and no lorikeets of any other species for sale
There's one thing selling excess birds cheaply to get rid of them, but these are repeat offenders.

OK- I promise- no more!!

[desertbirds]

If i trapped the local (feral ) population of Rainbows would be a hero or a villan ?