Yellow Siskin x Goldfinch mule project

[elferoz777]

by now young goldfinches would have fledged so I believe this one is growing more at a siskin pace.

Look at the colours, red brown wings with black bards and a red brown tail. I though I could see yellow flanks.

In the foto we can see the crop is a little full which is a good sign. At approx 16 days of age we should see this one fledge soon with a little luck!

[elferoz777]

https://youtu.be/BF6yyeN_7CU

Youtube update.

[E Orix]

It's a pity you couldn't breed your pure birds rather than spend time and effort on breeding hybrids.
In my opinion if you convince just one person to copy what you are doing, it is a disservice to Aust. Aviculture.

[elferoz777]

I see your views but think there are bigger concerns fir our hobby than breeding one infertile mule.


Im my opinion the greater sin is the uncontrolled breeding and selling of mutations.

Outside if clubs and show societies There is no one alive that can tell me their gouldians 100% have no aussie yellow genes these days.

There would be fewer still that could guarantee the genetic history of thiet zebra finches.

I also think the uneducated mixing of closely related species is a bigger problem e.g the recent crossing of a ruddy and ob. How many people would see this happen by accident or on purpose that we don't hear about.


Unlike rfpf x bfpf crosses or what ever else accidentally gets created on routine basis, my mule was bred for purpose. I think this whole process will educate and support aviculture. As mentioned mules are often bred as feeders and fosters for more challenging or rare species.

You will note my collection consists of rare species such as oriental greenfinches and lineolated parrots and i target species where possible where i can help bulster the numbers.

[Tiaris]

I can 100% guarantee that my Gouldians do not have Aust yellow genes in them. I can also 100% guarantee the genotype of the Zebra Finches I breed & sell.
Ruddies & Orangebreasts are not closely related at all. They have been kept & bred in the same aviaries on many thousands of occasions and it is an extreme rarity for them to hybridise.
I understand that you have specifically undertaken to breed your hybrid & don't intend to breed from it, however these feeble and false other notions to justify it just don't have merit at all. Yes, ignorance and apathy regarding mutation genes is a threat to the genetic purity of many species as is hybridisation to other species.
Pointing out some other obvious threats to the genetic integrity of our limited captive stocks of pure species is absolutely no reason to deliberately legitimise another deliberate action - more so stronger reason to breed as pure as possible to preserve what we have.
My last point is that you cannot possibly know at this stage that your hybrid is infertile.
I understand that you enjoy the idea of producing cup-nesting hybrids as do an increasing number of people who now live in Australia, but I simply stand by my right to express my views in relation to it whenever I have the opportunity to do so. I don't wish to change your own opinion or motivations for doing what you do with your birds - just to put the counterview to other aviculturists when this topic arises in a public forum so that people can make a measured judgement on where they draw the line as to what they are prepared to do in their aviaries.

[E Orix]

I agree Tiaris
By the way I also have a strain of Normal Black Headed Gouldians which are totally free of any mutations.
As are my Red Painteds
I know it's a persons right to fiddle but what annoys me is when they broad-cast it.
New people to the hobby may start to think that it is a normal practice and it is not.

[elferoz777]

Who are we to say what is normal?

This post has promoted a lot of discussion which is a good thing. Overreacting like this is only going push people to not day anything if they accidentally or deliberately do this.

And if i cant "broadcast" on this site freely then whats the point of the forum. There is no site rules against iif you don't like it dont read or reply or if your a mod ban me ! Or block my content.

Im not a d $#k about what i donor do i encourage others but i share for any who are interested.

[COUNTRY CAPITAL]

my two cents worth.....
I think our efforts need to be directed towards pure bloodlines also and parent-reared if at all possible.

I too believe I have pure normal gouldians, not a mutation now for about 7 years or so.
I wish I could say the same for my stars, rfpf, fires etc etc where cinnamon/fawn/pied raises its head regularly.

I too have the dubious honour of producing a zebra x African fire clutch of 2 a few years back.
I gave them to a family member as pets so at least their fertility was not tested.

your mule project may enable you to get some rarer birds on the perch but is it sustainable?
often birds produced in this way fail to be able to raise there own young down the track so the problem persists....

as others have said I think you should pour your energy into producing a line of birds that improve that little bit each generation rather than just hanging on.
long live the forum

[finchbreeder]

I sure can't say 100% if my Gouldians are normal. Only which I believe are and which I believe are not. Thought my Ruddies were possible split pied, and then Pink shows up out of no where. And my Zebs are definately, whatever they look like with a dose of Heinz 57 though I can give you a fair idea what they carry. And I have had a couple of hybrids nests over the years thanks to my Bengos.
So lets all accept that we agree that breeding naturally occuring birds is the best thing to do. But that a challenge is important to many breeders.
People get that challenge by breeding mutations and hybrids.
Live and let live as long as honesty is applied.
Elf is being honest.
I would like to see some of his naturally occuring species progress.
LML

[Craig52]

Following this thread with interest. Great constructive criticism with no anger is the way to go, remember our red canaries came from the red siskin x canary and we didn't/haven't lost our red siskin population as they are a very endangered specie in their home land.
Yes this forum is the place to post your views but please constrain yourselves to other people's opinions, it's not that hard. Craig