Just an opinion.

[pdg]

I am well aware of the kind of Australian proudness or way of thinking you are referring to Mick and I fully respect it. To be clear: I didn't say ringing had to be compulsory. I said it was compulsory in Europe, for native birds. It should be national - (even if) not compulsory - because people buy birds from all over the country. With national I don't mean compulsory. You'd still have your freedom to decide.

The impatient and inexperienced need the help of experienced breeders, like Eorix understood. What he did was the best he could do. That man walked away a bit wiser (I hope) because Eorix cares about the impatient and the inexperienced, although they did at first not have any trust. I was once inexperienced and impatient too, Iike a lot of breeders; who ever starts off as the master breeder. And I was happy to learn quick with the help of other breeders. It all depends on how open you are to new things and ways of thinking I guess.

What about the other arguments on buying or selling birds that haven't fully moulted? Eorix's original problem?

[murf]

I'm with Tiaris. I have a "secluded" section in the aviary where-by my finches can find security. I might venture into that area once a fortnight/month, certainly not nest inspections. I have my chair for observation and have a good idea as to what is going on. I'm afraid I'm too trusting when it comes to picking birds. I'll accept someone's word that a pair are last seasons. Do I get caught out... occassionly. One thing about the sales, I thought that as part of the conditions a sale was awarded to a Club was that birds had to be fully coloured..... sorry if I'm wrong.

[TomDeGraaff]

The Victorian Regulations require that a bird be self-sufficient before selling. Uncoloured is another matter.

[murf]

Apologies and thanks for the correction.

[natamambo]

Compulsory closed ringing is impractical on so many levels. It assumes the ability to access the young which is not possible with our breeding methods (aviaries rather than boxes) or with our species (nest types, intolerance of inspections and so on). However, it is a burden on the breeder which would provide no practical benefit to the hobby or the birds we keep.

E tried to protect someone from themselves, at the end of the day no amount of legislation around our hobby will prevent charlatans as sellers or fools as their clients. We've all made mistakes, most of us want to learn from them. At the end of he day though, our hobby must revolve around a certain element of trust as you learn who to trust .

[SamDavis]

I mentioned this closed ring thread at our recent finch club. A number of experienced members said it wouldn't work with smaller sized species as it's possible to close ring them even as adults. For instance, apparently the closed Zebbie rings can be fitted to adult Zebs. If true then any closed ringing of these smaller species is a complete waste of time. And by smaller species I think they meant most Aussie and Africans. Therefore I assume it's only the larger Europeans (and canaries of course) where closed rings work as the foot must grow sufficiently larger.

I've only ever close rung budgies - never tried to close ring a finch so I can't say first hand if above is true. Maybe a few European members can chime in with their experiences....

[Kinna]

that is very good advice for a new comer! this is a whole new world to me.

[Tiaris]

I used to close-ring young Gouldians at 5 - 7 days old. With the correct ring size, they slip off at a younger age and won't go on much after 8+ days without risking hurting the foot.