Two quotes:
"Another species on the path to destruction thanks to mutation breeding." . . Mattyboy
"A pair of normals cost $50." . . JusDeb
At that price they appear to be in little danger.
Could anybody name a couple (or in fact a single) finch species, with facts to back them up, which has been lost to Australian Aviculture "thanks to Mutations"?
Mutation breeding is a legitimate area of bird breeding, whether the birds are quail, parrots, finches, or strutting ducks.
In fact most mutation breeders have done more to establish secure populations than those who pan them.
what happened to all the cordons?!!!
- Mickp
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I cant name any species that have disappeared due to breeders concentrating on mutations
we have lost a few species due to the gene pool drying up thanks to the govt not allowing new birds into the country. a few other species are apparently in trouble as well.
we have lost a few species due to the gene pool drying up thanks to the govt not allowing new birds into the country. a few other species are apparently in trouble as well.
Mick.
Finch addict and rodent hater.
Finch addict and rodent hater.
- Mattyboy
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Arthur, the loss of genetic diversity and pure wild-type lines due to the proliferation of mutations is pretty obvious. Many birds may look phenotypically correct but carry hidden mutant genes.
Good luck trying to find a pure-wild type budgie or zebra finch after decades of mutation breeding. There are of course some lines of "bush budgies" and probably wild-type zebs around, but the point is that they have been sourced from the wild, and very recently, because the captive stocks have become a genetic train wreck.
It won't ever be possible (or desirable) to source wild Gouldians ever again. Think about that. Nor will we ever get new wild-type Cordons in Oz while import restrictions continue.
Good luck trying to find a pure-wild type budgie or zebra finch after decades of mutation breeding. There are of course some lines of "bush budgies" and probably wild-type zebs around, but the point is that they have been sourced from the wild, and very recently, because the captive stocks have become a genetic train wreck.
It won't ever be possible (or desirable) to source wild Gouldians ever again. Think about that. Nor will we ever get new wild-type Cordons in Oz while import restrictions continue.
- fincher
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(anyone that exports foriegn finches should be locked up in jail or shot). there should also be a black book of the people selling birds overseas and no one should sell birds to them that is my opinion
- finchbreeder
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I must admit there are many types of finch in which I much prefer the original types to the mutations.
But I am guilty of my normal Zebs are all split for something.
So Yes I would want pure strains of each type of finch to be maintained.
But I would also want new mutations to be established.
I know this is have a bob each way but if it can be achieved I see nothing wrong with this.
LML
PS - yes please I would like a Red cheeked cordon bleu hen![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_e_biggrin.png)
But I am guilty of my normal Zebs are all split for something.
So Yes I would want pure strains of each type of finch to be maintained.
But I would also want new mutations to be established.
I know this is have a bob each way but if it can be achieved I see nothing wrong with this.
LML
PS - yes please I would like a Red cheeked cordon bleu hen
![Very Happy :D](./images/smilies/icon_e_biggrin.png)
LML
- E Orix
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We seem to have moved away from the Cordon Blue stream onto mutation bashing so I will have my pennies worth.
Personally I wish that there was no such thing as a split, because these are what causes the problems.
I get really "p" off when I put new blood into my stock and up turns a mutation.If a Sea Green P/F turns up or a yellow Painted out go the young and the parents. There are a few mutations I do like and keep. Those mutations are kept well away from my stock of normal birds,sadly the are many people in our hobby that have no idea of genetics or care about selling splits as a pure bird.When mine are disposed of they are normally given away and the people are told they are not pure normals.
Many years ago when I was shown a picture of a persons white Gouldian I remarked that it looked like a white Bengalese, he was insulted and I thought why get excited about a pure white bird when the normal bird is so attractive.
The majority of the pied examples are not as pretty as a normal,the Cordon and Pied Cordon is in my opinion a good example.
We are all different, but people must be more careful when disposing of their split birds.
Personally I wish that there was no such thing as a split, because these are what causes the problems.
I get really "p" off when I put new blood into my stock and up turns a mutation.If a Sea Green P/F turns up or a yellow Painted out go the young and the parents. There are a few mutations I do like and keep. Those mutations are kept well away from my stock of normal birds,sadly the are many people in our hobby that have no idea of genetics or care about selling splits as a pure bird.When mine are disposed of they are normally given away and the people are told they are not pure normals.
Many years ago when I was shown a picture of a persons white Gouldian I remarked that it looked like a white Bengalese, he was insulted and I thought why get excited about a pure white bird when the normal bird is so attractive.
The majority of the pied examples are not as pretty as a normal,the Cordon and Pied Cordon is in my opinion a good example.
We are all different, but people must be more careful when disposing of their split birds.
- Mickp
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there's a line that I think almost all of us would agree upon, if only more breeders would tell the truth about a birds parentage/historyE Orix wrote:but people must be more careful when disposing of their split birds.
Mick.
Finch addict and rodent hater.
Finch addict and rodent hater.
- finchbreeder
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Well I for one don't need a Cordon hen anymore. He died of loneliness.
Or maybe old age.
It would sure be good if everyone told all when selling birds.
But I am sure there are a few genuine cases of ignorance, where the gene has carried through for ages, not showing up.
I know of an instance in a budgie breeders aviary where a chick turned up that couldn't.
Till the breeder checked the records back and yes each side contained a possible split for great grand parent.
That is where good record keeping is jolly useful.
And I confess not my strong point.
But I do if in doubt say is could be split for.
LML
![Crying or Very Sad :cry:](./images/smilies/icon_cry.png)
Or maybe old age.
It would sure be good if everyone told all when selling birds.
But I am sure there are a few genuine cases of ignorance, where the gene has carried through for ages, not showing up.
I know of an instance in a budgie breeders aviary where a chick turned up that couldn't.
Till the breeder checked the records back and yes each side contained a possible split for great grand parent.
That is where good record keeping is jolly useful.
And I confess not my strong point.
But I do if in doubt say is could be split for.
LML
LML
- Mickp
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I dont see how anyone can claim that a bird is pure unless they have been breeding them for a few generations and have kept records.
am trying to have my gouldians breed true but figure that it will be a few years before I can actually tell people they breed true to colour.
but then if the birds are to inbred there will always be the chances of a mutation occuring.
am trying to have my gouldians breed true but figure that it will be a few years before I can actually tell people they breed true to colour.
but then if the birds are to inbred there will always be the chances of a mutation occuring.
Mick.
Finch addict and rodent hater.
Finch addict and rodent hater.