Today's X-File - What went wrong

[tonytoast]

Ok, let me start by saying that this covers a few categories so popped it into 'General' due to my inability to choose.

Right, let me set the scene...pair of Gouldians (currently have two survivors of a nest of five, aged about 6 weeks and are doing fine) went back to the nest (same nest) pretty quickly and hatched out 6 young about a week ago. On Thursday I smelt the smell that you don't want to smell and found all six dead....what was a little odd was that the hen bird had what appeared to be oily belly feathers. Put it down to night fright and coldish morning. Cleaned the nest and replaced Friday and they are back in there today....all fine but she appears a little puffed up...

Now, I have a pair of lilac breasted Gouldians who in late May/early June had a nest of five dwindle down to a nest of 2 however I made the decision not disturb them too much and remove the dead babies. The two little ones hit the floor on the 4th June and were both dead by the 15th....very cold mornings was my guess and the nest deaths put down to first time parents.

Now the mystery....they went back to nest and had 6 young hatch...I chose to be more diligent with the checking (wasn't sure whether having dead babies in the nest last time was all that good for the other young) and pulled 3 dead young out over a period of a week or so. This morning I looked in the nest and the parents were not in there...which was odd. Pulled the nest down and what should I find, three dead babies...but wait, one moved. I grabbed it into my hand, blew heat and it stirred. The other two were dead, but my guess is 'recently' dead. What went wrong....was this another night fright or something else more sinister....what was even more interesting was that the hen Lilac Gouldian appeared to have oily feathers on her belly as well????? She was a little fluffed up this afternoon.

Now the variables:
- I have moved a number of new birds into the aviary over the last two weeks
- I changed seed last weekend, buying 'Breeders Choice' as my local stockfeed supplier was out of my usual
- The mornings have been coolish but not 'ridiculous' cold
- I treated all birds with Sulpha two weeks ago
- One of the birds has air-sac mite which was treated a month ago but has re-appeared. I am not treating it due to the Suplha treatment.

All these things could be blamed BUT I had similar results with the last clutches where none of these variables were at play....all birds are very healthy although the Suplha treatment was something I did across all my aviaries due to a couple of birds who did not perk up after hospital cage treatment.....oh, and most importantly, I am now hand rearing the 'close to death' little one and it has sparked up.

Unfortunately Fox and Scully are unavailable so I turn to you for your insights.

Tony

[jusdeb]

Got nothing except ...The truth is out there . Someone had to do it .

[finchbreeder]

Could the "oily feathers" be disintergrating young. Yucky thought but?
LML

[flap]

I did wonder that too.

[west finch]

Tony did the dead young have full crops ? And how cold do you call not to cold ?

[tonytoast]

I too had thought of the dead young causing the oily feathers....it also makes me wonder what potential pathogens are cultivated from decaying dead babies.

As for their crops, the six in one go were all pretty young and I don't remember seeing too much of anything at the time other than a pretty upsetting scene.....the three thismorning had nothing in the crops except the one which is still alive now which appeared to have about an eighth of a full crop. I am guessing that the parents were not sitting on them last night but they are about 14 days old.

As for temps, lowest was 13 degrees this morning, although the apparent temp was about 9...not cold enough in my book to kill three reasonably well feathered youngsters.

By the way, just fed the lone survivor and you wouldn't believe it is the same bird, given it was lying on its side when I found it....I was able to fill its crop and now it is down for the night. Hope it is in better spirits tomorrow am.

[west finch]

Yes temp dose not seam to be the problem . Day temps hear have only been about 15 c and night down to –6c . I had a lone chick fledge yesterday in my heated nest boxes witch would have died with out the heat but once they fledge there on there own and are normally ok. Sorry I digress it may just be bad parents . Had a few of them myself this year !

[arthur]

Work on the 10/10 rule

Babies < 10 days . . . Temp < 10 degrees

If parents not brooding at night, young will die

Bring box into house overnight and return first thing in morning



This may not have been the cause in this case, of course, but if young are full of feed but dead, it is usually cold weather related

[tonytoast]

Work on the 10/10 rule

Babies < 10 days . . . Temp < 10 degrees

Wow, interesting concept and I guess you need to draw the line somewhere....good tip which I am guessing is based on a fair amount of research.....cheers!

Have you ever had a situation where the parents haven't gone back to the nest in the am?

[arthur]

No . . but all birds are individuals

You'll save more than you'll lose



PS If hen is covering young, no need to remove box . . check about 15 min before dark to give time to return if you flush her . . if in doubt take it out