Well, that's dampened my mood.

[Nrg800]

http://www.zoochat.com/24/illegal-birds ... ey-121458/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[jusdeb]

Very very wrong and very very stupid ...What a waste .
Yes it is a does dampen ones mood hey .

[Jayburd]

bloody awful.
Wasn't there a big thing in the Australian Birdkeeper recently about this?

[toothlessjaws]

As was mentioned by the rational member Hix on the ZooChat thread, the likelihood is that the bird would be offered to ZAA (ARAZPA) institutional members before the option of euthanasia is considered.

for example Adelaide Zoo acquired two cock hycinth macaws that were confiscated after being illegally smuggled into the country many years ago. there is no reason to believe that they wouldn't request any additional confiscated birds (especially if they are female!). PRIAM Psittaculture Centre is, from memory an associate member of the ZAA and legally holds a pair of salmon crested cockatoos - i imagine its a possibility they may have interest in the supposed salmons from this "missing" collection.

this is, of course pure speculation, but my point is, so too is it speculation by this reporter that they may be put down. yes, the DWHA do have policy of euthanasia as an option but so too do they have of placing in ZAA facilities. there are many examples of this taking place over the years with birds, reptiles and even exotic mammals.

After having a read through the thread i think the desire by a particular fear-mongering non ZAA member zoo owner (and parrot breeder), that he is within his right to have first pick of these potentially lucrative birds is a case of pretty wishful thinking!

[Nrg800]

Yes, Hix is amazing, and after browsing through CITES Conference of Parties Resolution 10.7 myself it is very lenient in who gets confiscated birds. They can even be sold, so I think the issues are less, CITES related, and more related to the DEC (or, whatever they go through now). Not sure what has Happened to the birds now, waiting for some more knowledgeable people to inform me/the forum.

[finchbreeder]

Well that is some collection. I sincerely hope they all wound up in Zoos and and now busy living and hopefully breeding happily in these Zoos.
LML

[wagga]

We all hope for a good outcome on this situation. I some how have little faith in a governmental institution will do right by the birds, but will look at the BIG PICTURE concerning perceived threats to our fauna and flora. God for bid that one of these birds gets out into the wild and breeds taking over the domains of the native birds or introduces a exotic disease is probably the official government line. Big Brother I am sorry to say thats already done by other species. Did I mention for example pigeons they are legally allowed to fly all over the country side, as I type this down I am looking out the window and yep there goes some pigeons now, and ironically these parrots in question, which have been well looked after and housed in aviaries, dont have a hope.
Zoos coming to the rescue for these parrots will be a big ask in my opinion. The accommodation and veterinarian care costs by now would be huge coupling this with the unknown genetic heritage, stud book etc, would make this list of rare parrots unattractive to most.
Are they still alive? You would like to hope so. In the back of my mind I remember the Newcastle disease outbreak years ago and watching on TV the authorities exterminating all the birds they could find in the area. At the time I found this action was quick and brutal but justified, just in case these birds spread the disease. This type of action makes me think the same fate was bestowed upon these poor parrots for the protection of our country. Please someone tell me that I am wrong.

[GregH]

It’s pure bloody-mindedness. I've never seen a zoo in Australia or elsewhere that operates like a C5 facility - their birds are all kept in outdoor aviaries where they are exposed to wild birds should one land on the wire. To say that the quarantine risk is minimized in a registered zoo as opposed to a private keeper is utterly delusionary. Of course the mentality of the types of people that seek employment in regulatory enforcement mean you can't rationalize with them; they just enforce the rules. How to get rational rules is the BIG question. In most bureaucracies it seems that risk avoidance is confused with risk management as it offers a very quick solution to a problem with minimal research, cost or implementation time. Unfortunately bird keepers are a small and politically incorrect segment of society - you couldn't get away with the mass destruction of dogs and cats because they represent an threat to the environment and they most certainly are.

[toothlessjaws]

Zoos coming to the rescue for these parrots will be a big ask in my opinion. The accommodation and veterinarian care costs by now would be huge coupling this with the unknown genetic heritage, stud book etc, would make this list of rare parrots unattractive to most.

i don't understand. why do you think the accommodation and medical costs would be so high? or outside of the budgets of some of australia's large public or even small private zoos - many of which already house very large collections of birds?

unknown genetic heritage has never deterred zoos before - most wild caught animals are of unknown heritage and many, many species of zoo animals are subspecies hybrids of various races by necessity as zoos do not have enough founder base of individual races to run a subspecific program. zoo studbooks always consider animals of unknown heritage to be unrelated and none of the issues raised are anything new for zoos. melbourne zoo has a (presumably smuggled) loris (the primate for those that confuse their lories and loris') that was found in a cardboard box at a vet clinic doorstep.

[toothlessjaws]

It’s pure bloody-mindedness. I've never seen a zoo in Australia or elsewhere that operates like a C5 facility - their birds are all kept in outdoor aviaries where they are exposed to wild birds should one land on the wire. To say that the quarantine risk is minimized in a registered zoo as opposed to a private keeper is utterly delusionary.

i assume you are arguing that these birds should be allowed to be kept in private non-zoo licensed hands?

because firstly - zoo animals are not in quarantine. rather they have been quarantined. as you rightly said once on display the risks are just as great as in someones backyard. the difference between a legally zoo imported animal and a smuggled one is that the animal has not gone through the appropriate pre export and post export quarantine and testing that zoo animals have.

secondly, zoos have been burdened under just as strict import guidelines as the private sector - there is a tiny handful remnant species of birds in australian zoos (all functionally extinct mind you) that are not sourced directly from legally traded aviculture (condors, flamingos, rhea, crowned pigeons and curassow) and thats it. however the reason that zoos should be the priority for housing any confiscated birds is because of this:

a) most zoos have approved quarantine facilities.
b) all ZAA zoos will quarantine and screen any animals handed over to them with the utmost priority. and lastly...
c) giving the birds to a ZAA member zoos does not benefit the private avicultural sector. the birds will not be moved onto the list of species recognised as legally being kept by private individuals and thus continues to deliver reduced incentives for people to continue to smuggle in birds. ZAA zoos do not sell animals to each other, instead loaning, swapping or gifting them to one another as part of co-operative breeding programs to the benefit of the species.


i as much as anyone see the hypocrisy in some of the wildlife laws. but there is common sense in not allowing smuggled birds immediate (if ever) access back into the avicultural market and restricting their allocation to ZAA accredited zoos.